Comments on: First thoughts on CakePHP from a Rails perspective http://slagwerks.com/blog/index.php/2007/12/14/first-thoughts-on-cakephp-from-a-rails-perspective/ Thu, 30 Jul 2009 15:44:17 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0 By: Joe’s Amazing Technicolor Weblog » Blog Archive » puttering around with Symfony http://slagwerks.com/blog/index.php/2007/12/14/first-thoughts-on-cakephp-from-a-rails-perspective/comment-page-1/#comment-4423 Joe’s Amazing Technicolor Weblog » Blog Archive » puttering around with Symfony Thu, 24 Jan 2008 01:25:21 +0000 http://slagwerks.com/blog/index.php/2007/12/14/first-thoughts-on-cakephp-from-a-rails-perspective/#comment-4423 [...] advice from Nate, I’m taking Symfony for a spin (using the stable version 1, not the under-development 1.1), [...] […] advice from Nate, I’m taking Symfony for a spin (using the stable version 1, not the under-development 1.1), […]

]]> By: joe http://slagwerks.com/blog/index.php/2007/12/14/first-thoughts-on-cakephp-from-a-rails-perspective/comment-page-1/#comment-4038 joe Sat, 15 Dec 2007 19:49:38 +0000 http://slagwerks.com/blog/index.php/2007/12/14/first-thoughts-on-cakephp-from-a-rails-perspective/#comment-4038 Nate -- it's interesting to hear about the ArtsConnectedEd redo process. I didn't look at Symfony for this project mainly because the searching I did for Symfony & REST didn't turn much up, while there were a few examples of using CakePHP to do things a bit more like Rails' REST hotness. Looking forward to hearing more about how the ACE project works out. Max -- definitely agree with you on the language trends. It seems like most people (not all!) who give Ruby or Python an honest try don't feel like going back to Perl or PHP; as a consequence, Rails and Django look like some of the more interesting web development communities. Though you can never completely discount Scheme on Skis. Definitely agree that the Rails hosting situation is likely to keep getting better, as more and more people are using it & asking for it where they host. Nate — it’s interesting to hear about the ArtsConnectedEd redo process. I didn’t look at Symfony for this project mainly because the searching I did for Symfony & REST didn’t turn much up, while there were a few examples of using CakePHP to do things a bit more like Rails’ REST hotness. Looking forward to hearing more about how the ACE project works out.

Max — definitely agree with you on the language trends. It seems like most people (not all!) who give Ruby or Python an honest try don’t feel like going back to Perl or PHP; as a consequence, Rails and Django look like some of the more interesting web development communities. Though you can never completely discount Scheme on Skis.

Definitely agree that the Rails hosting situation is likely to keep getting better, as more and more people are using it & asking for it where they host.

]]> By: Max http://slagwerks.com/blog/index.php/2007/12/14/first-thoughts-on-cakephp-from-a-rails-perspective/comment-page-1/#comment-4036 Max Sat, 15 Dec 2007 15:19:02 +0000 http://slagwerks.com/blog/index.php/2007/12/14/first-thoughts-on-cakephp-from-a-rails-perspective/#comment-4036 Thanks for the insights. It will be interesting to see if any newcomers can catch up to Rails in the next 5 years. My intuition is that PHP and Perl have jumped the shark, while Ruby and Python are on the rise. Thus, I speculate that both of the problems that you cite for rails (lack of developer knowledge and lack of hosting support) will go away soon. I also speculate that if any platform rises up to overtake Rails, it will be based on Py, not PHP. Unsure, though. Maybe it will be Lisp on Rails! I'll be curious to hear more about your new project as it unfolds! Max Thanks for the insights. It will be interesting to see if any newcomers can catch up to Rails in the next 5 years. My intuition is that PHP and Perl have jumped the shark, while Ruby and Python are on the rise. Thus, I speculate that both of the problems that you cite for rails (lack of developer knowledge and lack of hosting support) will go away soon. I also speculate that if any platform rises up to overtake Rails, it will be based on Py, not PHP. Unsure, though. Maybe it will be Lisp on Rails!

I’ll be curious to hear more about your new project as it unfolds! Max

]]> By: Nate http://slagwerks.com/blog/index.php/2007/12/14/first-thoughts-on-cakephp-from-a-rails-perspective/comment-page-1/#comment-4035 Nate Sat, 15 Dec 2007 14:26:04 +0000 http://slagwerks.com/blog/index.php/2007/12/14/first-thoughts-on-cakephp-from-a-rails-perspective/#comment-4035 This last year we actually went through a similar "what framework?" sort of activity for the redesign of ArtsConnectEd, and we've landed on Symfony. Worth a look if you get a chance, but the online tutorial (Askeet) is a bit deprecated at the moment... So it's hard to take for as easy of a spin, but I believe the "first app" page is still mostly right. I took a good look at CakePHP but without having a Rails background it didn't appeal as a crossover framework. Symfony really seems to have better docs, a better community, and is using a lot of "best of breed" open source pieces all tied together into a nice framework. Anyway, my latest nightmare has been the ORM plugin - Doctrine is going to be incredible, but it's still beta and after almost a week of messing with it I still couldn't get it to do inheritance the way I wanted, and Propel wasn't using PDO. Finally there's a (beta) version of Propel 1.3 which does use PDO and is waaaay faster thanks to it, so I've gone back to Propel. So far so good on the inheritance and many-to-many-to-many tables I've been forcing at it. Hopefully I'll get around to blogging all this at the Walker soon, but it's been hard because I keep second guessing my decision! This last year we actually went through a similar “what framework?” sort of activity for the redesign of ArtsConnectEd, and we’ve landed on Symfony. Worth a look if you get a chance, but the online tutorial (Askeet) is a bit deprecated at the moment… So it’s hard to take for as easy of a spin, but I believe the “first app” page is still mostly right.

I took a good look at CakePHP but without having a Rails background it didn’t appeal as a crossover framework. Symfony really seems to have better docs, a better community, and is using a lot of “best of breed” open source pieces all tied together into a nice framework.

Anyway, my latest nightmare has been the ORM plugin - Doctrine is going to be incredible, but it’s still beta and after almost a week of messing with it I still couldn’t get it to do inheritance the way I wanted, and Propel wasn’t using PDO. Finally there’s a (beta) version of Propel 1.3 which does use PDO and is waaaay faster thanks to it, so I’ve gone back to Propel. So far so good on the inheritance and many-to-many-to-many tables I’ve been forcing at it.

Hopefully I’ll get around to blogging all this at the Walker soon, but it’s been hard because I keep second guessing my decision!

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